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Not with a bang but a whimper, RISCOS Ltd |
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Martin Bazley |
Message #121824, posted by swirlythingy at 23:35, 26/1/2013, in reply to message #121823 |
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An eight year old quote from Castle's COO suggesting it was the ROL shareholders' fault that things weren't moving forward is not about saving the work the company did. Nor is it anything to do with licensing. Good grief, if you don't have anything constructive to add, the least you could do is stop trolling. |
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Simon Willcocks |
Message #121825, posted by Stoppers at 09:53, 27/1/2013, in reply to message #121824 |
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An eight year old quote from Castle's COO suggesting it was the ROL shareholders' fault that things weren't moving forward is not about saving the work the company did. Nor is it anything to do with licensing. Good grief, if you don't have anything constructive to add, the least you could do is stop trolling.
Firstly, I'm not trolling.
Secondly, what was it about then?
Thirdly, with regards to saving their work, it doesn't seem that ROL own much of their later work, anyway:
http://iconbar.com/forums/viewthread.php?threadid=12010&page=1#121635
The opening up of RISC OS Six code to a public audience is highly unlikely to happen because a lot of the new 32 bit work in RISC OS Six was done by external developers working with RISCOS Ltd for their own projects with code being supplied to RISCOS Ltd on an exclusive basis. Anyone wanting to get access to RISC OS Six code would have to negotiate with lots of different people. |
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Wouter Rademaker |
Message #121826, posted by egel at 11:41, 27/1/2013, in reply to message #121825 |
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ROL owns the right to use the work. Probably is included in all the license agreements, what should happen with those rights if ROL would cease to exist, would sell their IP, would enter into a merger, etc..
Most importantly, how will the largest possible portion of the work stay available. It would be a shame if it all would be lost. It is certain that something will be lost, but let's try to limit it.
[Edited by egel at 11:53, 27/1/2013] |
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Nicholas Kingsley |
Message #121828, posted by MrTAToad at 23:35, 27/1/2013, in reply to message #121826 |
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In addition, will this affect ROOL ? |
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Martin Bazley |
Message #121832, posted by swirlythingy at 09:30, 29/1/2013, in reply to message #121828 |
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But then again, after yet another evening which consisted of double-clicking on every game I could find on my hard drive - all of which had been updated to be StrongARM-compatible - and getting the "Unable to start application" error on every damn one, there is a substantive argument to be made in favour of dancing on ROL's grave. |
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Jason Togneri |
Message #121834, posted by filecore at 10:25, 29/1/2013, in reply to message #121832 |
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But then again, after yet another evening which consisted of double-clicking on every game I could find on my hard drive - all of which had been updated to be StrongARM-compatible - and getting the "Unable to start application" error on every damn one, there is a substantive argument to be made in favour of dancing on ROL's grave. +1
For a while I had a text file going with a list of which games worked, which didn't, which were patched, which worked but ran too fast/slow, the various error messages each failing game generated... but it got too much, and now I simply don't bother trying anymore. |
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Peter Howkins |
Message #121837, posted by flibble at 14:25, 29/1/2013, in reply to message #121834 |
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Things progress, RISCOS Ltd gets its first mention in the London Gazette, part of the process of dissolving a company.
http://www.london-gazette.co.uk/issues/823984/supplements/1394
"COMPANIES ACT 2006
NOTICE IS HEREBY GIVEN, PURSUANT TO SECTION 1000(3) OF THE COMPANIES ACT 2006, THAT AT THE END OF THREE MONTHS FROM
THE DATE OF THE PUBLICATION OF THIS NOTICE, THE NAMES OF THE COMPANIES LISTED BELOW WILL, UNLESS CAUSE IS
SHOWN TO THE CONTRARY, BE STRUCK OFF THE REGISTER AND THE COMPANIES WILL BE DISSOLVED."
http://www.london-gazette.co.uk/issues/823984/supplements/1349 |
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David Heath |
Message #121914, posted by HeathHayle at 10:18, 15/2/2013, in reply to message #121837 |
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The mystery deepens just tried to phone Riscos LTD and the phone number doesn't work but the web site is still there
[Edited by HeathHayle at 10:19, 15/2/2013] |
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Rob Kendrick |
Message #121918, posted by nunfetishist at 12:09, 15/2/2013, in reply to message #121914 |
 Today's phish is trout a la creme.
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The website isn't hosted at their offices, it's a third-party supplier. It'll probably just keep running and keep sending ROL bills that'll never get paid. |
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Wouter Rademaker |
Message #121919, posted by egel at 13:10, 15/2/2013, in reply to message #121918 |
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It is hosted by
http://www.heartinternet.co.uk / http://www.extendcp.co.uk
(wonderfull what a ping can tell you)
WHOIS information for riscos.com:***
Domain Name: RISCOS.COM
Creation Date: 1998-10-30
Expiry Date: 2014-10-29 |
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Rob Kendrick |
Message #121920, posted by nunfetishist at 13:45, 15/2/2013, in reply to message #121919 |
Today's phish is trout a la creme.
Posts: 522
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Yes, but the registration of the domain does not relate to how long they've paid for hosting, or how long without bills being paid the hoster will pull the plug. |
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Stephen Scott |
Message #121921, posted by sa_scott at 16:20, 15/2/2013, in reply to message #121920 |
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Are we therefore in imminent danger of shedloads of resource material disappearing when the hosting provider pulls the plug?
Or has it already been done?
Whatever one thinks of the merits of their material is one thing, but it will be of use to some people surely? |
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Wouter Rademaker |
Message #121922, posted by egel at 17:55, 15/2/2013, in reply to message #121921 |
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Only what is under http://select.riscos.com/Private/ will be lost. The rest has a backup on http://web.archive.org/web/*/http://www.riscos.com/ and many other sites.
[Edited by egel at 15:34, 3/3/2013] |
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Wouter Rademaker |
Message #121957, posted by egel at 19:55, 1/3/2013, in reply to message #121790 |
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Justin Fletchers ramble from Thu, 28 Feb 2013 gives some information on when and where it went wrong.
[Edited by egel at 19:57, 1/3/2013] |
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Jeffrey Lee |
Message #121958, posted by Phlamethrower at 21:32, 1/3/2013, in reply to message #121957 |
 Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot stuff
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www.riscos.com's plug now appears to have been pulled - it's redirecting to a holding page. |
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Steve C |
Message #121960, posted by Steve at 12:43, 2/3/2013, in reply to message #121958 |
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www.riscos.com's plug now appears to have been pulled - it's redirecting to a holding page. Seems to be working from here still (for now anyway). |
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Robert Hampton |
Message #121961, posted by Hampo at 15:28, 2/3/2013, in reply to message #121960 |
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I couldn't access it last night, but it is indeed back today.
It looks like someone has updated the page as well - it has a 2013 copyright date at the bottom and some out of date stuff (the Wakefield 2012 banner and "Latest News" proclaiming RISC OS Six from 2009) has been removed from the home page.
Doesn't seem to be any acknowledgment of ROL's predicament anywhere on the site, however. |
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Paul Vernon |
Message #121962, posted by PaulV at 02:45, 3/3/2013, in reply to message #121961 |
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http://foundation.riscos.com is still missing (the one with the pdf PRM's). It's just redirecting to the main www.riscos.com site now. |
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Wouter Rademaker |
Message #121963, posted by egel at 15:33, 3/3/2013, in reply to message #121962 |
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http://foundation.riscos.com is still missing (the one with the pdf PRM's). It's just redirecting to the main www.riscos.com site now. http://web.archive.org/web/*/http://foundation.riscos.com/Private/* |
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Andrew Flegg |
Message #121965, posted by Jaffa at 21:38, 3/3/2013, in reply to message #121963 |
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http://web.archive.org/web/*/http://foundation.riscos.com/Private/* Have you actually tried downloading any of the PDFs? None of the ones I tried work. |
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Paul Vernon |
Message #121966, posted by PaulV at 00:53, 4/3/2013, in reply to message #121965 |
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Try this:
http://archive.retro-kit.co.uk/ |
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Wouter Rademaker |
Message #121967, posted by egel at 11:00, 4/3/2013, in reply to message #121825 |
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Thirdly, with regards to saving their work, it doesn't seem that ROL own much of their later work, anyway:
http://iconbar.com/forums/viewthread.php?threadid=12010&page=1#121635
The opening up of RISC OS Six code to a public audience is highly unlikely to happen because a lot of the new 32 bit work in RISC OS Six was done by external developers working with RISCOS Ltd for their own projects with code being supplied to RISCOS Ltd on an exclusive basis. Anyone wanting to get access to RISC OS Six code would have to negotiate with lots of different people. Were the external developers Stuart Tyrrell Developments / Advantage Six Ltd or were there others too? If we can believe Justin Fletcher, it was intended that much of the 32 bit work would be done by STD/A6 but in reality that did not happen.
[Edited by egel at 11:01, 4/3/2013] |
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Robert Hampton |
Message #121981, posted by Hampo at 21:46, 5/3/2013, in reply to message #121962 |
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The plot thickens: http://www.riscos.com/investment/The www.riscos.com website will be undergoing maintenance over the next few weeks so please bear with us. This page will remain in place until the re-design has been completed.
From Monday the 4th of March 2013 the contact details for www.riscos.com have changed to: 3QD Developments Ltd 3QD are, of course, the developers of the VirtualAcorn range. I'm intrigued to see what happens next. |
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Rob Kendrick |
Message #121983, posted by nunfetishist at 22:12, 5/3/2013, in reply to message #121981 |
Today's phish is trout a la creme.
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"RISC OS is � Copyright 3QD Developments Ltd. 2013"
I CHORTLE.
Look forward to any possible future releases of ROL RISC OS requiring you to ring Aaron while he's not on holiday before you can turn it on. |
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VinceH |
Message #121984, posted by VincceH at 22:35, 5/3/2013, in reply to message #121981 |
 Lowering the tone since the dawn of time
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From Monday the 4th of March 2013 the contact details for www.riscos.com have changed to: 3QD Developments Ltd
Pretty much what was predicted in a conversation at my stand at the SW Show. It was obvious, really. |
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Martin Bazley |
Message #121985, posted by swirlythingy at 01:47, 6/3/2013, in reply to message #121984 |
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From Monday the 4th of March 2013 the contact details for www.riscos.com have changed to: 3QD Developments Ltd
Pretty much what was predicted in a conversation at my stand at the SW Show. It was obvious, really.
Not so much for those of us who weren't at your stand (or the show).
Oh, if only there were some sort of online synopsis of the events that transpired that fateful day, written by someone who attended, perhaps in some manner of blog-like format, this could have been old news ages ago... |
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VinceH |
Message #121989, posted by VincceH at 09:43, 6/3/2013, in reply to message #121985 |
Lowering the tone since the dawn of time
Posts: 1600
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Oh, if only there were some sort of online synopsis of the events that transpired that fateful day, written by someone who attended, perhaps in some manner of blog-like format, this could have been old news ages ago... It's coming.
The problem is I'm supposed to be doing less and relaxing more, so I'm limiting the amount of time I spend on such things (essentially, anything I consider "work" even if it doesn't bring in any money) so that overall I'm doing no more in a full week than would equate to a normal working week. IYSWIM.
Having said all that, in what I've written so far, I've already passed my stand and I didn't mention that conversation at all. It was just idle speculation on the part of me and whoever I was talking with at the time (I've forgotten).
But the reason it was obvious was quite simple.
Firstly, Aaron's company had to pay ROL a licence fee for the ROM image in each copy of VirtualRPC sold (dunno how many he's selling these days, though) - so it would make sense financially for that company to acquire the ROL versions of RISC OS, before anyone else gets a chance; no more licence fee means a higher profit margin per copy sold (and/or a price reduction). (For that matter, was it down to ROL that it was necessary to tie VirtualRPC to a network adaptor and therefore a specific machine? ie, does this mean Aaron can now release VirtualRPC on a memory stick?)
Secondly, and somewhat more cynically, because he was in a good position to be able to do this, and was one of the more vocal people at times in the RISCOS Ltd vs Castle ownership of RISC OS argument, then getting hold of the ROL versions before anyone else has a chance means he's made sure it can't wind up on a path that'll lead it to ROOL. And, if he so chooses, he can stick a finger up at everyone, stick his tongue out and blow a raspberry (but not a pi).
Personally (obviously) I'd have liked to have seen the ROL version of RISC OS end up in ROOL's hands* - but I can't blame Aaron at all for seizing the opportunity to prevent that from happening (if that was his motive - and I suspect it was, at least in part), given his position on the whole argument.
* Either directly or indirectly. Which reminds me. Further up-thread, someone quoted Paul Middleton from another thread, where he'd said (in an email to someone):
The opening up of RISC OS Six code to a public audience is highly unlikely to happen because a lot of the new 32 bit work in RISC OS Six was done by external developers working with RISCOS Ltd for their own projects with code being supplied to RISCOS Ltd on an exclusive basis. Anyone wanting to get access to RISC OS Six code would have to negotiate with lots of different people.
While it's true that opening it up (through ROOL or otherwise) would necessarily involve negotiations with lots of people, it's not an insurmountable problem. That had to be done in the first place for everything ROOL has published, and was the reason some things took longer to appear. That is therefore not the reason "the opening up of RISC OS Six code to a public audience is highly unlikely to happen" at all. It was always because those that held it simply didn't want it to happen.
[Edited by VincceH at 09:48, 6/3/2013] |
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VinceH |
Message #121990, posted by VincceH at 09:46, 6/3/2013, in reply to message #121989 |
Lowering the tone since the dawn of time
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Heh. And if I was writing this event up as a post on RISCOSitory, which is what I will do eventually - and probably would have done already if it wasn't for all this silly health nonsense, a lot of what I'd written there would probably form part of the post.  |
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Paul Vernon |
Message #122005, posted by PaulV at 12:06, 8/3/2013, in reply to message #121966 |
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I've been asked by Aaron to remove my mirrors of the RISCOS.com sites that I had so now they're no longer available.
Paul |
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Rob Kendrick |
Message #122006, posted by nunfetishist at 13:29, 8/3/2013, in reply to message #122005 |
Today's phish is trout a la creme.
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Did he say why? Please keep the data, even if it's not online. |
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