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The Icon Bar: The Playpen: Its, like, a new program!
 
  Its, like, a new program!
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Jeffrey Lee Message #76452, posted by Phlamethrower at 21:53, 13/6/2006
PhlamethrowerHot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot stuff

Posts: 15100
Now you can telnet into your RISC OS machine and perform activities of a command-line oriented nature while at work/on holiday/having sex!

Disclaimer: You will only be able to perform the advertised activities when I fix a few bugs and upload the program.
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Phil Mellor Message #76456, posted by monkeyson2 at 22:22, 13/6/2006, in reply to message #76452
monkeyson2Please don't let them make me be a monkey butler

Posts: 12380
:o
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Andrew Duffell Message #76460, posted by ad at 22:52, 13/6/2006, in reply to message #76452

Posts: 3262
So... the same as !TelnetD ?
I wanna play...
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Jeffrey Lee Message #76461, posted by Phlamethrower at 22:54, 13/6/2006, in reply to message #76460
PhlamethrowerHot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot stuff

Posts: 15100
So... the same as !TelnetD ?
Possibly, but Google wasn't being very cooperative when I tried searching for similar programs :P

I wanna play...
:o

(Will do a proper webpage eventually, along with the long-procrastinated Other Update)
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Jeffrey Lee Message #76462, posted by Phlamethrower at 22:58, 13/6/2006, in reply to message #76461
PhlamethrowerHot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot stuff

Posts: 15100
*finds a copy of !TelntD*

Yes, the same as that, but 10 times smaller and 10 times crapper.
  ^[ Log in to reply ]
 
Jeffrey Lee Message #76463, posted by Phlamethrower at 23:03, 13/6/2006, in reply to message #76462
PhlamethrowerHot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot stuff

Posts: 15100
Now I have to go back to looking for something useful to write that someone else hasn't written yet :P
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Jason Tribbeck Message #76465, posted by tribbles at 23:12, 13/6/2006, in reply to message #76463
tribbles
Captain Helix

Posts: 929
Seems like Open Office has had a request :E
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Jeffrey Lee Message #76467, posted by Phlamethrower at 23:14, 13/6/2006, in reply to message #76465
PhlamethrowerHot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot stuff

Posts: 15100
Ah, but that's a port of existing software, not a new piece of software :P
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Andrew Poole Message #76470, posted by andypoole at 23:18, 13/6/2006, in reply to message #76467
andypoole
Mouse enthusiast
Web
Twitter

Posts: 5558
Ah, but that's a port of existing software, not a new piece of software :P
Well write ROOffice, then :P
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Jeffrey Lee Message #76471, posted by Phlamethrower at 23:21, 13/6/2006, in reply to message #76470
PhlamethrowerHot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot stuff

Posts: 15100
Nah :P

I could write an RSS reader, and call it !ARSS, but I'm sure we already have enough of those on the platform (RSS readers, not arses. Although...)

Instead, I think I'll work on that Other Update, since the DeathDawn editor manual thingy has been ready for about a month now.
  ^[ Log in to reply ]
 
Phil Mellor Message #76472, posted by monkeyson2 at 23:26, 13/6/2006, in reply to message #76471
monkeyson2Please don't let them make me be a monkey butler

Posts: 12380
RISC OS Animal Crossing!
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Lewis Westbury Message #76479, posted by instantiator at 10:31, 14/6/2006, in reply to message #76463
Member
Posts: 365
Now I have to go back to looking for something useful to write that someone else hasn't written yet :P
secure telnetd?
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richard cheng Message #76485, posted by richcheng at 11:19, 14/6/2006, in reply to message #76471

Posts: 655
Nah :P

I could write an RSS reader, and call it !ARSS, but I'm sure we already have enough of those on the platform (RSS readers, not arses. Although...)

Instead, I think I'll work on that Other Update, since the DeathDawn editor manual thingy has been ready for about a month now.
With all due respect to Monkeyson, we don't have any really good RSS readers on RISC OS, and I, for one, would love one.
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richard cheng Message #76488, posted by richcheng at 11:26, 14/6/2006, in reply to message #76485

Posts: 655
Or! A RISC OS frontend for Inform 7!

(Not that the backend is available on RISC OS yet, either.)
  ^[ Log in to reply ]
 
Phil Mellor Message #76489, posted by monkeyson2 at 12:20, 14/6/2006, in reply to message #76488
monkeyson2Please don't let them make me be a monkey butler

Posts: 12380
Or! A RISC OS frontend for Inform 7!

(Not that the backend is available on RISC OS yet, either.)
:o

That looks very nice!
  ^[ Log in to reply ]
 
richard cheng Message #76490, posted by richcheng at 12:42, 14/6/2006, in reply to message #76489

Posts: 655
Or! A RISC OS frontend for Inform 7!

(Not that the backend is available on RISC OS yet, either.)
:o

That looks very nice!
Hells yeah! I've only given it a very brief try, so I can't comment much on the actual language side of things, but the IDE is just awesome, compared to what I've used in the past for my IF dabblings.
  ^[ Log in to reply ]
 
Jeffrey Lee Message #76492, posted by Phlamethrower at 13:13, 14/6/2006, in reply to message #76488
PhlamethrowerHot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot stuff

Posts: 15100
Or! A RISC OS frontend for Inform 7!

(Not that the backend is available on RISC OS yet, either.)
Crikey :o

Must-write-RISC OS-port!
  ^[ Log in to reply ]
 
Richard Goodwin Message #76495, posted by rich at 14:44, 14/6/2006, in reply to message #76463
Rich
Dictator for life
Posts: 6828
Now I have to go back to looking for something useful to write that someone else hasn't written yet :P
How about that 32bit neutral networking module I keep banging on about, which would enable other people to do use it to write their own RSS feeders etc.?

Justin Fletcher's one enabled me to write a link checker that worked for web, ftp, news and email links in web (and wml!) pages, just by telneting in to various ports and seeing what came back. But he removed the module from his site and it never (officially) got upgraded. So LinkCheck is also dead.
________
RichGCheers,
Rich.
  ^[ Log in to reply ]
 
richard cheng Message #76498, posted by richcheng at 14:56, 14/6/2006, in reply to message #76495

Posts: 655
Now I have to go back to looking for something useful to write that someone else hasn't written yet :P
How about that 32bit neutral networking module I keep banging on about, which would enable other people to do use it to write their own RSS feeders etc.?

Justin Fletcher's one enabled me to write a link checker that worked for web, ftp, news and email links in web (and wml!) pages, just by telneting in to various ports and seeing what came back. But he removed the module from his site and it never (officially) got upgraded. So LinkCheck is also dead.
I remember that link checker! It was awesome!
  ^[ Log in to reply ]
 
richard cheng Message #76500, posted by richcheng at 15:03, 14/6/2006, in reply to message #76495

Posts: 655
Now I have to go back to looking for something useful to write that someone else hasn't written yet :P
How about that 32bit neutral networking module I keep banging on about, which would enable other people to do use it to write their own RSS feeders etc.?
Is libcurl

a). 32bit neutral
b). any good for this?

I've been planning to investigate using this to write a RISC OS Audioscrobbler plugin for yonks, but it never seems to bubble to the top of the todo list.
  ^[ Log in to reply ]
 
Richard Goodwin Message #76502, posted by rich at 15:11, 14/6/2006, in reply to message #76500
Rich
Dictator for life
Posts: 6828
Now I have to go back to looking for something useful to write that someone else hasn't written yet :P
How about that 32bit neutral networking module I keep banging on about, which would enable other people to do use it to write their own RSS feeders etc.?
Is libcurl

a). 32bit neutral
b). any good for this?

I've been planning to investigate using this to write a RISC OS Audioscrobbler plugin for yonks, but it never seems to bubble to the top of the todo list.
Might be (I'll have to look into it more), but the previous stuff I was doing allowed me to open sockets and talk HTTP, SMTP, NNTP[*] etc. directly, so it was very flexible. I *think* curl is more "give it an address and it'll return the response".

curl/wget/etc. was definitely the way I was going to go for auto update checks with !HTML3 however.

* Actually, I couldn't use NNTP directly in the end, because I didn't know what server would be valid for the end user - I did a web fetch to a CGI on this server, and this server did the NNTP stuff, because it was on the Pipex news fetching allow list.
________
RichGCheers,
Rich.
  ^[ Log in to reply ]
 
Jeffrey Lee Message #76522, posted by Phlamethrower at 21:41, 14/6/2006, in reply to message #76495
PhlamethrowerHot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot stuff

Posts: 15100
Now I have to go back to looking for something useful to write that someone else hasn't written yet :P
How about that 32bit neutral networking module I keep banging on about, which would enable other people to do use it to write their own RSS feeders etc.?
Could do, I guess. Although my Iyonix hasn't arrived yet so I have no way of checking if it's 32bit compatible. What kind of stuff did you need it to do? What would the SWI interface be like? etc. And (IIRC you wanted to use it primarily from BASIC) why can't you just write a BASIC library that provides a friendly interface to the Socket SWIs?
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Richard Goodwin Message #76541, posted by rich at 08:42, 15/6/2006, in reply to message #76522
Rich
Dictator for life
Posts: 6828
Could do, I guess. Although my Iyonix hasn't arrived yet so I have no way of checking if it's 32bit compatible.
Start work on the 26bit version, get it 32bit later ;)

What kind of stuff did you need it to do?
Connect very easily to other computers! :)

Basically, a set of SWIs that allow me to telnet in to any port on another machine, and very easily read the data back. However, it has to be
a) not a full telnet client that happens to have an API, because
b) needs to be small, and distributable within my own software.

Yes, it should probably be installed in people's !System.modules, but if it's not, I want to be able to put a fallback copy in my own software as in the olden days, so the software actually works first time.
What would the SWI interface be like? etc.
Um.... I dunno. Will a wishlist do?

You'd have to have something that connects to a server on a certain port; I'm presuming we're sticking to sending strings to TCP and not using it for ICMP or UDP or specially crafted bytes, but hey, if you want. I want control over line endings, because IIS is a bastard over those. I then want to wait for output - probably line-by-line so I can get the first line (e.g. HTTP response headers), the full headers or the whole thing. I want to be able to set a timeout, and know if the thing timed out rather than just not getting any lines back. And I want to use it from BASIC!
And (IIRC you wanted to use it primarily from BASIC) why can't you just write a BASIC library that provides a friendly interface to the Socket SWIs?
If I could just write a BASIC library that provides a friendly interface to the Socket SWIs I wouldn't be asking, would I? :) But feel free. If that does what I need, I'll be able to stop harping on about it. But then, you might only end up with me using it, and not others.
________
RichGCheers,
Rich.
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VinceH Message #76543, posted by VincceH at 09:03, 15/6/2006, in reply to message #76541
VincceH
Lowering the tone since the dawn of time

Posts: 1600
But then, you might only end up with me using it, and not others.
In fact, such a module would be very useful, so it wouldn't just be you that uses it - I would as well; it could have some handy applications in WebChange. Though it'll probably take me about 10 years to actually reach a point where the new version is releasable, and another 10 years before a version comes out that makes use of this module.

So there's no rush. ;)
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Jeffrey Lee Message #76544, posted by Phlamethrower at 09:16, 15/6/2006, in reply to message #76541
PhlamethrowerHot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot stuff

Posts: 15100
I want control over line endings, because IIS is a bastard over those. I then want to wait for output - probably line-by-line so I can get the first line (e.g. HTTP response headers), the full headers or the whole thing.
So something like:

SYS "SocketSWIThingy_SendLine",socket,str$,line_end_type
SYS "SocketSWIThingy_ReadLine",socket,line_end_type,buffer,buffer_length TO $str (Syntax is probably wrong on that one)
SYS "SocketSWIThingy_SendData",socket,buffer,length
SYS "SocketSWIThingy_ReadData",socket,buffer,length TO bytes_read

So that you can read/write binary data and read/write lines? line_end_type would allow you to choose between CR, LF, CR-LF, and LF-CR. Unless you have some other line ending types you can think of :)
  ^[ Log in to reply ]
 
Lewis Westbury Message #76550, posted by instantiator at 10:03, 15/6/2006, in reply to message #76489
Member
Posts: 365
Or! A RISC OS frontend for Inform 7!

(Not that the backend is available on RISC OS yet, either.)
:o

That looks very nice!
Its extraordinary!
  ^[ Log in to reply ]
 
Richard Goodwin Message #76571, posted by rich at 14:50, 15/6/2006, in reply to message #76544
Rich
Dictator for life
Posts: 6828
I want control over line endings, because IIS is a bastard over those. I then want to wait for output - probably line-by-line so I can get the first line (e.g. HTTP response headers), the full headers or the whole thing.
So something like:

SYS "SocketSWIThingy_SendLine",socket,str$,line_end_type
SYS "SocketSWIThingy_ReadLine",socket,line_end_type,buffer,buffer_length TO $str (Syntax is probably wrong on that one)
SYS "SocketSWIThingy_SendData",socket,buffer,length
SYS "SocketSWIThingy_ReadData",socket,buffer,length TO bytes_read

So that you can read/write binary data and read/write lines? line_end_type would allow you to choose between CR, LF, CR-LF, and LF-CR. Unless you have some other line ending types you can think of :)
I don't mind adding the line endings to the string (eg dunno if zero-terminated lines are handy) but ISTR Mr. Fletcher's one had some kind of binary switch for something. Although that might have been "first (or last?) line of data", so sent something different itself.

But yes, it looks good.

Presumably you'd also need:
SYS "SocketSWIThingy_Connect",server$,port[,proto] TO socket,result
(where result is success or fail in some way; perhaps success, timed out, server not found?)
SYS "SocketSWIThingy_Disconnect", socket (?)
SYS "SocketSWIThingy_SetTimeout",timeout (in seconds - or would this be in the Connect SWI, rather than global?)

Oh, and it needs to be fairly multi-tasking capable - if I can put a poll loop in there, so people aren't waiting around for data to return (esp. if the fetch times out), then that'd be great. So ReadLine would need to read whatever has came back from the socket, not sit there waiting for it.
________
RichGCheers,
Rich.
  ^[ Log in to reply ]
 
Richard Goodwin Message #76573, posted by rich at 14:56, 15/6/2006, in reply to message #76543
Rich
Dictator for life
Posts: 6828
a BASIC library that provides a friendly interface to the Socket SWIs ... But then, you might only end up with me using it, and not others.
In fact, such a module would be very useful, so it wouldn't just be you that uses it - I would as well
Presumably you'd prefer a module to a BASIC library though? I'd much rather have the module, which is way beyond my own programming ability to create, but allows everyone to use it, than a handy BASIC library.
________
RichGCheers,
Rich.
  ^[ Log in to reply ]
 
Jeffrey Lee Message #76574, posted by Phlamethrower at 15:21, 15/6/2006, in reply to message #76571
PhlamethrowerHot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot stuff

Posts: 15100
Presumably you'd also need:
SYS "SocketSWIThingy_Connect",server$,port[,proto] TO socket,result
(where result is success or fail in some way; perhaps success, timed out, server not found?)
You're handling all the protocol stuff yourself, aren't you? I.e. everything you need to do can be done over a standard TCP connection.

SYS "SocketSWIThingy_SetTimeout",timeout (in seconds - or would this be in the Connect SWI, rather than global?)
Doesn't bother me!

Also there'll be a status SWI, to find out if there's any data available, how long since last receive, etc.

Oh, and it needs to be fairly multi-tasking capable - if I can put a poll loop in there, so people aren't waiting around for data to return (esp. if the fetch times out), then that'd be great.
I can probably stick a socketwatch type thingy in so it can set your pollword when data is received. Maybe have a few options, e.g. so it only triggers your app once a full line is available.

How fussy are you about buffering data being read/sent? Maybe have a SWI (or two) to set the IO buffer sizes?
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Jeffrey Lee Message #76575, posted by Phlamethrower at 15:22, 15/6/2006, in reply to message #76573
PhlamethrowerHot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot Hot stuff

Posts: 15100
a BASIC library that provides a friendly interface to the Socket SWIs ... But then, you might only end up with me using it, and not others.
In fact, such a module would be very useful, so it wouldn't just be you that uses it - I would as well
Presumably you'd prefer a module to a BASIC library though? I'd much rather have the module, which is way beyond my own programming ability to create, but allows everyone to use it, than a handy BASIC library.
Yes, a module would be better, I was just wondering why you hadn't written a library to do it yourself :) The Socket SWI's may look a bit scary at first glance but aren't too bad once you know how to use them (obviously)
  ^[ Log in to reply ]
 
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